Author Interview: Mark Binelli

The following is an interview with Mark Binelli, the author of the novel, Sacco and Vanzetti Must Die! (Dalkey Archive, 2006).  He is also a journalist who has written many pieces for Rolling Stone, The Believer, and other outlets.  He lives in New York.

(A quick note of apology for the slacking research as I toss two questions to Mark about his days at the University of Michigan, butchering information on both)

Dan:

Thank you, Mark, for taking some time from your schedule to answer some questions.

Mark:

No problem.

Dan:

You’re listed as a native Detroiter in your biographies.  Actually Detroit, or a suburb?  Or, was your family one of the many, many (as was my own) that started in Detroit proper and moved to the suburbs in the late 60’s or early 70’s?

Mark:

I grew up in St. Clair Shores, a suburb on the east side. (Between 8 and 9 Mile, for non-Detroiters who’ve seen the Eminem movie.) (Trivia: the trailer park depicted in that movie is actually in SCS.) My parents both emigrated from Northern Italy, my mom’s family to SCS and my dad originally to Detroit proper. (6 mile!)

Dan:

You attended the University of Michigan as an undergraduate.  Was it the fact that it was the big university in the area that drew you there, or did you go to attend a specific school?

Mark:

The former. Really did sadly little research into schools.

Dan:

It was a journalism degree there, correct?  Did you take any creative writing course while you were there?

Mark:

It was an English degree, with a creative writing sub-concentration. I took a class with Nick Delbanco, who I believe still runs the MFA program, and a really cool woman named Tish Ezekiel. But did lots of journalism as well, at the school newspaper.

Dan:

You went on to receive an MFA at Columbia, right?

Mark:

Yes. People knock MFA programs, often for good reason, but it really worked for me. Coming from a freelance background, I needed deadlines, and the knowledge that people would be reading my work, that fear of public humiliation. I had two workshops with Ben Marcus and a seminar with Lawrence Weschler, who were both fantastic. I found the rest of the program a bit lackluster, at least at the time, though I’ve heard it’s much better now. I also found having a peer group extremely helpful. There’s nothing like being surrounded by other people who are just as excited about books and writing as you. (Incidentally, one of my best friends, Dinaw Mengestu, who was at Columbia at the same time, just published a novel, The Beautiful Things That Heaven Bears, that’s getting rave reviews. I’d highly recommend it.)

Dan:

You have had a really nice run as a journalist, writing for Rolling Stone, The Believer, and other outlets.  Looking through your Rolling Stone articles, you’ve done features on a wide variance of people – from Britney Spears to Kid Cannabis, to Ali G before he was big on HBO, and the list goes on.  Who did you enjoy meeting and writing about the most?  How about the worst?  Any really big surprises from what you expected vs. what you ended up meeting?

Mark:

Michael Moore was great. We Michigan-bonded, and he took me to his favorite donut shop in Flint. More recently, I interviewed Don DeLillo, which was intimidating but very exciting for me, as I love his work. And Jeff Tweedy from Wilco is a great guy, very smart, just someone you’d want to be friends with. (He also had an amazing library.) Worst was probably Britney, but I don’t want to kick someone while they’re down, so I’ll leave it at that. She was really horrible, though. Surprises? Hmm. We joke in the office about Stockholm Syndrome, how you end up liking most of the people you interview more than you expect, if you spend enough time with them... not just personally, but their music. So, yeah, I worked on a long Hanson profile a few years ago and remember listening to their second album obsessively, months after the story was done. This sounds kind of creepy in hindsight, as I type it. 

Dan:

A fair amount of your journalism has dealt with bands, or the music industry.  You also used to be involved with the university radio station at UM.  Do you still do your best to keep up with new bands these days?

Mark:

I’ve actually never worked at a radio station. But yeah, I keep up. Not as much as I used to. But I get sent lots of music, and then hear about things from colleagues. My favorite newish album has been LCD Soundsystem’s Sound of Silver. And this band Lavender Diamond sounds great live.

Dan:

Sacco and Vanzetti takes these two real-life people, and creates new lives for them, of a slapstick, comedic team.  The first thing that came to my mind when reading of the slapstick adventures were the Abbott and Costello movies that used to run in the Detroit area on Sunday mornings when I was a kid.  Did you watch these as well when you were younger, and if so, how influential do you think they were on this novel?

Mark:

Yes! It was a Sunday morning ritual for me and my dad, who, being Italian, was (and is) a shameless fan of broad slapstick. (Remember this is the country that produced Roberto Benigni.) I was thinking of Abbott and Costello more than any other comedy team when writing this book.

Dan:

Did you also happen to be a regular at the Royal Oak Music Theatre Three Stooges Festivals?

Mark:

I loved the Stooges when I was kid, but never made it to Royal Oak. (That was on the west side. I think I was probably in high school before I got out there for the first time.)

Dan:

What was it about slapstick teams that came to mind for you when you started looking at Sacco and Vanzetti?

Mark:

The initial impulse was completely superficial: I thought they had the perfect name for a comedy team. That was it. Only later did the link between anarchy and slaptick begin to seem like something I might play around with.

Dan:

How hard was it to convince yourself that going the slapstick route was the way to go?

Mark:

The decision to write about a comedy team came first. I liked the idea of coming up with an entire filmography for a fictional Abbott and Costello-type duo. The variety of scenarios this would allow certainly added to the appeal. Then, as I said, once S&V entered the picture, the idea suddenly had much more depth, and allowed me to touch on ethnicity, anarchy, class... so much more.

Dan:

Did you have to do a lot of research for this novel?  It seems as if you’ve become well-versed in many different arenas to get this one done.

Mark:

Yes, the research became rather addictive after awhile. I had to cut myself off at a certain point. The history of the anarchist movement, particularly as it relates to Italians, was all fascinating. (For instance, Mikhail Bakunin, a Russian who figures prominently in Tom Stoppard’s The Coast of Utopia, played a major role in the development of the anarchist movement in Italy.) And then, of course, watching old comedy films was fun. I’ve mentioned this before, I think, but I particularly enjoyed discovering that the Chico Marx character in the Marx Brothers’ Room Service is named Harry Binelli. There’s nothing quite like hearing Groucho yell, “Binelli! Get in here!”

Dan:

There’s a comment within the novel about the knife sharpening scenes, looking back at them, after many of the characters are dead and buried, how they shouldn’t be tension filled.  Was this in a response to your own feelings of tension watching great slapstick teams?

Mark:

I don’t think so. I did have a great-uncle who would immediately turn off the television if someone dead appeared in a movie or TV show. I’m not sure why. (He was also convinced he had a humpback.)

Dan:

Did you find yourself, and your own sense of humor, falling more into line with one of the two characters through their routines?  If so, did you find yourself setting up scenes more with him in mind than the other?

Mark:

Personality-wise, I’m definitely closer to Vanzetti. (That is, not especially extroverted.) I’m not sure about sense of humor. I definitely tried to avoid favoritism and give them a balance of scenes.

Dan:

Do you think the non-fiction writer in you shows up much in the novel?  Perhaps in the “Supplemental Material” or “Historical Interludes” sections?

Mark:

Definitely. Also in the faux-film criticism and the interview transcripts. Most nonfiction writing has very prescribed rules, concerning style and length and what sorts of information you’re required to put across, so it was interesting to refract that sort of writing through fiction.

Dan:

Night Moves – really one of your top fives, or is that the Detroiter in you coming out?

Mark:

That was kind of facetious, I’ll admit. Although I generally do love that album, and happened to be listening to it when I made the Top Five list you’re referring to. Though growing up I always hated Seger. You couldn’t turn on the radio in Detroit without hearing “Old Time Rock & Roll.” Which is actually still kind of a shitty song.

Dan:

Living in New York, have your sporting allegiances changed, or did you enjoy the hell out of last summer with the Tigers?

Mark:

Sorry, I’m so sports-ignorant, I have no idea what happened last summer with the Tigers. Although I’m sure my brother mentioned it at the time, and then made fun of me for not knowing what the hell he was talking about.

Dan:

Lastly, if you were a character in “Fahrenheit 451,” what work(s) would you memorize for posterity?

Mark:

The Dead Father by Donald Barthelme. I’m sure someone else would probably have Shakespeare covered.

Dan:

Thanks again, Mark, for taking some time to answer these questions.

Mark:

My pleasure. Thank you.