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May 26, 2006

LBC Podcast #4: Yannick Murphy

Lbcspring4Nominator:  Carrie A. A. Frye

Nominee:  Yannick Murphy, Here They Come

Subjects Discussed:  To Kill a Mockingbird, Dodie Smith's I Capture the Castle, Here They Come as autobiography, bending spoons with your mind, sleepless nights of inspiration, the similarities between surrealism and realism, hot dog vendors, points of reference as a coping mechanism, writing a New York-based novel in California,  the A&P as a reflection of socioeconomic values, working with Eli Horowitz.

Backup Link:  (MP3)

(A co-production of the LBC and The Bat Segundo Show.)

 

May 25, 2006

Interview with Yannick Murphy

The following is an interview with Yannick Murphy, author of the short story collection, Stories in Another Language (Knopf, 1987), the NY Times Notable novel, The Sea of Trees (Houghton-Mifflin, 1997), and the novel, Here They Come (McSweeney’s, 2006), not to mention the forthcoming children’s book, Ahwoooooooo!.  She currently lives in Pasadena, CA with her husband and three children.

Dan:

Hello Yannick.  Thank you for taking some time away from your day to answer some questions.

Yannick:

Dan, thank you.  I think it's great that you publish these interviews with lesser-known authors like myself.  I really appreciate it.

Dan:

I see that there’s been nearly a decade span between each of your three non-children titles.  Does this indicate slow writing?  Or difficulty finding publishers?  Or something else altogether?

Yannick:

Never slow writing, I actually write pretty quickly.  But for a while there it was an agent who was slowing me down.  I had a very reputable agent for "The Sea of Trees" and every subsequent book I showed her she thought should be re-written a certain way before she sent it out to publishers.  When I showed her "Here They Come" she thought that what should be fleshed out in the story was the relationship between the narrator and her friend Rena.  (She was also concerned about the amount of "human detritus" I included in the book).  It was not a direction I was comfortable going in, so instead of re-writing it her way, I shelved "Here They Come" for a long time.  Meanwhile, I wrote other novels which my then agent still thought should be written different ways.  Finally I reached up and took "Here They Come" down off the shelf and re-read it and decided that I really wanted to see it published.  I think I even told my husband something stupid like, "Honey, before I die, I want to see this book published."  Anyway, I decided to leave this prestigious agent that no one ever left and go in search of another agent.  I finally found Judy Heiblum who fell in love with "Here They Come" and was game enough to send it out.

Dan:

It’s not too difficult to find an article these days proclaiming how difficult it is to sell a story collection, especially without a novel to go along with it.  However, your first book was a collection of stories.  Was the market better for such collections 20 years ago than it is today?

Continue reading "Interview with Yannick Murphy" »

Slight Delay

Sorry, Yannick Murphy did an amazingly fast job at getting my questions answered but I've had an exciting morning of cars dying, long walks, and surprise visitors at my desk when I finally did get to work - please stop by later as her replies to my questions are well worth your time.

May 24, 2006

Replies

I'd like to get back to what Eli said about temporal twistiness - you see that's what I think separates the boys from the men in the editing world (and the women from the girls if apropos).  A lesser editor would have read the first draft of my book and probably gone running with their tail between their legs because it had this temporal twistiness (I think Eli's coined a phrase here), but Eli rose to the occasion and didn't see it as a reason to not publish the book.  He was ready to sit down with me and do the work needed to get the book in the right shape, most editors balk at that and what they want is a book that's not going to make them have to think, it's much easier to line edit than to imagine the entire scope of the book and its design.

So it was Stendahl who said that about writing being a mirror walking down a road - thanks for aiding my memory, or setting it straight.  Brian Evenson might be right about getting dizzy walking down a road holding a mirror that way, but you know there's a trick to these things.  I learned it in spoon bending academy, if you're ever carrying a bowl of soup, a glass of liquid, or something you don't want to spill, don't ever look at it and don't ever look at the floor while you're walking, instead look straight ahead.  This will prevent you from ever spilling. It really works.  Try it.  Somehow this ties in to mirrors and Stendahl.  Right about now you are being to feel bad for Eli and all the work he must have had to do in order to make a bit of sense out of my mish-mosh train of thinking and the writing in Here They Come.

Oh Ignatius the Hunchback - no, never thought of the similarities between John and Ignatius.  John was a real guy.  John really looked like the way I described him too.  He really did have all these photos of girls taped to the side of his metal hot dog cart. He was sleazy, but there was a good side to him too.  At first it was hard to show that a sleazy character could be a good egg too, but with help from Eli, I think we were able to pull it off.  In the fictional world, people want to categorize the characters so quickly - good, bad, evil, etc. but in my books, even the pedophile gets a fair shake.  I just have a hard time believing that someone can be 100% evil, or a 100% anything for that matter.  Am I the only one getting dizzy holding this mirror? 

Replies

Hey everyone.  Eli, how did you sneak in here?  Maybe it was just a big mis-communication.  Maybe Eli said to me to make the book more "technological" instead of "chronological" maybe he wanted to see everyone on cell phones in the 1970's.  John the Hot Dog Man with a cell phone in one hand and his tongs in the other.  (Oh, by the way, we have decided we would cast the movie ourselves and that William Shatner would play John the Hot Dog Man and Leonard Nimoy would play Manolo - any suggestions are welcomed, all we need now is a billion or so dollars and a man with a camera, and someone to take sound.)

Ah, spoonbending.  Carrie, I've been telling everyone how that was a once in a life-time thing that I actually did that, but it seems to engage everyone so much I'm going to have to make something up.  I'm going to have to let out the big secret that yes, I can still spoon bend!  When I was a kid I was watching television with my mother and sisters and there was a talk show on and Uri Geller was a guest.  He was some pyschic who showed the audience how if they had an old broken watch at home that if they just held onto it and directed mental energy toward it that they could get the watch to work again.  Well, we did that at home and lo and behold, I got some cruddy old Timex to start working again.  Then Uri pulled out the old spoon trick and showed us on screen how he did it, and again, the powers were with me and I bent our metal spoon! (which was probably dirty and just pulled from the kitchen sink).

Hmmm, books I recommend.  Let's see underrated books would be anything by Christine Schutt, Dawn Raffel, Noy Holland, Victoria Redel.  Rightly rated - Blood Meridian by Cormac McCarthy, Angle of Repose by Stegner. There's a lot of good books out there, despite all my rantings that there aren't enough good books to read.

Here I Am

I think you’re all doing such a great job discussing my book, I can’t imagine what I could add to the discussion!  I mean it, all of your comments are so well thought out, and everyone seems so knowledgeable about the craft of writing good fiction.  It’s a pleasure to read the comments.  Your comments are so much more insightful than any of the published reviews I’ve received.  It’s such a relief to find that people really “get” the book and “get” what I intended for the reader to feel while reading it.  I’m one of those writers who really believes that you can “show” rather than “tell” a story and you’re right, a lot of writers out there are busying themselves with telling conventional stories with conventional plots and because of it they are missing out on all the other ways there are of being on the page and of sounding on the page.  A lot of writers think it’s their responsibility to instruct or entertain the reader, whereas I believe it’s more important to witness – I think it was Michael Ondaatje who said, “a writer should be like a mirror walking down the road” and that’s how I try and think while I’m writing.  I also do something else while I’m writing, and that is to say something that no one would dare, dare put down, and that I’m telling a truth that no one else would dare utter.  But I can tell by your spot-on comments you already see that, you already know all that about me!

One of the things that I always find interesting about writing books is the editorial process that the book undergoes after the first draft is written – at first under my own hand, and then under an editor’s hand.  When I first wrote “Here They Come” I jumped back and forth a lot between the seasons of the year (and I also jumped into the future and then explained events in the past and present, for example, in the very beginning the girl lets the reader know that the dog fell down the elevator shaft and died, then again, towards the end of the book she brings up the scene again, only telling it a slightly different way, with different details).  I think for a while it worked in the book, I think it was in keeping with the narrator’s random way of thinking, but when it came time for my editor to edit the book, he suggested I make the telling of the events more chronological.  In a way I was sad to change the exact manner in which I had originally written the book, (for some reason I think there’s some magic that an original version contains that subsequent drafts can’t quite achieve), but then I decided that the book was probably confusing enough without me jumping back and forth between seasons and the time.

In the original version I also gave more weight to each of the character’s thoughts and imaginings.  I kind of gave in to their desires to revel in their past lives and memories.  I had the idea that if I could let the reader know what these characters were daydreaming about, then it would help serve to tell the story of this girl and how her family ended up being the way that they were.  Here, for example, is a section about Ma Mere (the grandmother) that I elected to leave out of the original manuscript because instead of adding to the momentum of the girl’s own story, it seemed to draw attention away from it.  It is still a method of writing that I’d one day like to make work, maybe some day I’ll get it right.  Anyway, this is a section where the narrator is imagining what Ma Mere might have remembered from an event in her own married life.  I was soooo close to leaving it in the final draft that I feel I owe it to you to include it here.

Ma Mere was alone on a balcony in the wind on a night when the dog’s were howling, pacing in their run by the garden.

            “Shh, shh,” she said, but hardly loud enough for the dog’s to hear and maybe she said it more to herself, to slow her fast beating heart.  She was waiting for her husband to come home.  She thought she would be able to see him coming down the path, or at least see the moon’s reflection in the glass he would be holding that he would always leave with from the bar or the party.  Her kitchen was filled with glasses that did not match, from times before he had come home drink in hand.  Sometimes the rims colored with different lipsticks.  Like fingerprints she thought she could find the woman whose lips matched the lipstick stains.  In the morning she would serve him his juice in the unwashed glass he had walked home with, she would wait to see if he said anything about the lipstick, or at least try to wipe it off, but he never did, and he would fit his lips right over the stain of the lipstick and swallow his juice.

            She saw him come with another woman this time.  He had never done that before.  He held both their glasses as the other woman held up her skirt and danced in front of him on the path towards the house.  He stopped on the path and toasted the dancing woman and told her bravo and then lifted both the glasses to his lips and drank from them at the same time.  She wondered where he was planning to go with this woman, would he bring her to their bedroom?  Would he lock the balcony so that she would be trapped outside, having to listen to their lovemaking through the glass doors, seeing their dark forms through the filmy curtains? 

            The dogs began to whine.  It was their call to their master.  He heard them from the path and he yelled and they stopped their whining but started to claw against the fence of their run.  She could hear them panting with the effort and she thought if she had to be locked outside on the balcony, then listening to her husband and this woman make love would not be so different than listening to the frantic gestures of the dogs. 

            The woman was no one she knew and she wondered where she came from.  Off the boats moored out to sea, perhaps, vacationers who sailed the coast.  She tried to catch her French, listen for faulty pronunciation, and she heard it as well as the German coming through, scattered “ya’s” and glottal stops on words supposed to fall away, as in “pas” she thought, a word meant to linger in the French, but from this woman’s mouth it was cut short.  She didn’t not want to hear this woman in ecstasy, she thought it would sound like a steam train making its way up and over a mountain.  The whistle blowing shrill and the iron wheels clanging on the rusted ties.  She went inside and heard them now in her house.  The woman’s shoes scraping on the tile, her husband turning on the radio.  And then her husband calling her.

            “Matilde!  Matilde! he called.  From the top of the stairs she could smell the perfume.  It was beautiful, some kind of blossom smell she had only known when walking down paths at night, never knowing in the dark what the flower was. 

            “Feel,” she said to the German woman, and she took the German’s hand and placed it over her heart. 

            “Sit down,” the German said and the German said to Matilde’s husband, “Go and get the woman a glass of water,” and the German sat down beside Matilde and held her hand and moved Matilde’s hair so that it now was placed behind her ears. 

            “Eating enuff?” the German asked.  Matilde nodded her head.  “Sleeping?” the German then said, and Matilde nodded her head again.  “Then it’s the summer,” the German said, “the summer skitters all our hearts,” she said and then she took Matilde’s hand and had Matilde feel her heart and Matilde felt such a strong regular beat she wanted to leave her hand there on the German’s breast to see if her own heart would follow the rhythm. 

            Her husband brought the water in one of the same glasses they had taken with them from the party and had been drinking their drinks from.  She could faintly taste the whiskey and smell the cigarette smoke that seemed to come up from the glass’ lip.  Her husband sang and held his hands out to the German, wanting her to dance with him to what was playing on the radio, but the German put her finger to her lips, telling him to be quiet and then pointing to a chair where he should sit.  It was a chair by the window which faced the dog run and his dogs knew he was there and they were jumping up behind him, two, three feet in the air, their heads and paws sometimes banging on the glass, jumping by his shoulders, looking as if they had come forth from inside him, some sort of demons he could not keep contained. 

            Matilde leaned her head back on the sofa. 

            “That’s right, relax,” the German said and smoothed back Matilde’s hair. 

            With her head still back Matilde said to the German, “Tell my husband we’re going to have a baby.” 

            “Ah, you hear that,” the German said, taking a pillow from the couch and hitting Matilde’s husband square in the face with it.  “You shall be a Papa, that’s wonderful!  Congratulations,” she said and she grabbed Matilde’s cheeks and leaned over Matilde and kissed both her cheeks and her lips and then her husband rose and stood over them, and pulled the German to her feet and made her kiss him instead.  Matilde then stood up and left them and went out to the door, to the dogs, where when she came into their run, they didn’t even turn to notice her, they were watching the German and Matilde’s husband through the glass, and she knelt down by the dogs and put her hands on their heads and watched too, until daylight when the summer sun was already hot with its rising, and the dogs, like the German and Matilde’s husband had curled up and gone off to sleep. 

            She went to the beach then and swam in a flat sea and when she returned to her house, the German was gone and her husband was sitting up, his head in his hands, rubbing his chin.  She stood in front of him.

            “Do you happen to know the name of the perfume she wore?” Matilde said while she handed her husband a lipstick stained glass of juice.  Her husband shook his head. He did not know.

            “Your dogs need to get out of there,” she said and she pointed to the run through the window glass and her husband nodded his head and he stood and she could hear him go outside and hear the dogs whining and then her husband opening the run’s gate and him telling the dog’s to heel by his side as he walked down the path away from the house.

Anyway, I originally thought that this section would give the reader more of a clue as to why the grandmother, the mother, and the daughter were all a little “f---ked” up when it came to men.  I don’t know, in the end I think it was still a wise choice to leave it out of the final draft, (my editor thought so too) but I can tell you it was not an easy decision.

Okay, I’m ready for any questions you may have and I look forward to them!

Thanks,

Yannick

May 23, 2006

Hiya to Yannick and Smitty!

Just a reminder: Tomorrow the LBC welcomes Yannick Murphy, author of Here They Come, to the site (*cough* spoonbending anecdotes, please *cough*). On Thursday, return for her interview with Dan Wickett. And Friday, there’ll be a fab Segundo podcast for you to listen to in the cubby.

One last discussion note: From the start, I’ve been confidently noting that the novel’s narrator goes unnamed. Today a person connected to the book kindly reminded me that she does, in fact, get named once in the novel:

I’m the one who shops and I’ve got ten bucks for two days to feed the five of us. Polly at the A & P knows I’ve only ever got ten bucks and she says “How ya doing, Smitty?” Then she passes through a bunch of my items without ringing them up and gives me a wink. I even come home with change. Tom does it too, but his nose is huge and red and usually has a ripe white pimple on it, so I don’t like to stand on his line, but like I said, he’ll do it too and not charge me for some items and wink when he’s packing the bags and call me Smitty.

One Paragraph

Here They Come is so well written that it makes me want to quote page after page and sing the praises of the sentences and rhythms and images and tones.  Instead of indulging myself quite so much, I'll just quote a paragraph and offer some comments.  It's not a paragraph I spent much time looking for -- really, I just flipped through a few pages and this one caught my eye.  The book is full of paragraphs as good as this:

I dial my father.  He's been missing for weeks and I think maybe he's come back.  I imagine him shopping at Balducci's, buying persimmons and shiny egg-white baked bread.  But there's no answer.  I slam the phone receiver down on the floor.  It bounces.  I do it again.  There is now a nick in the floorboard.  I don't put the receiver back in its cradle.  I sit in the chair, my mother's chair.  It gets dark, but I don't turn the light on.  The recorded voice tells me to hang up the phone.  Then it finally stops and the phone is now quiet.  I look through the drawers in my mother's table, the one with all the burn marks on it.  In the drawers are ripped photos.  All the photos are of my mother with her missing arm around where my father used to be, but I can't find the halves with him in them.

There's a fine mix of humor and pathos in this paragraph, with the odd details -- "buying persimmons and shiny egg-white baked bread", the ripped photos -- filling out a moment where the narrator yearns for her lost father, and, by extension, so much else.  She doesn't just feel frustrated, she throws the receiver down; the receiver doesn't just hit the floor, it makes a nick in the floorboard.  But there's more -- the receiver lies there until the recorded voice comes on, a perfect detail of loneliness and emptiness, a literal and metaphorical lack of connection.  And then those photos.  We move from the aural detail of the phone to the visual detail of the photos, a detail that again conveys information about the characters while also creating a rich image.  The photos are in the table "with all the burn marks on it."  The mother's arm is missing, a lost limb, an amputated part of the self that was thrown away along with "where my father used to be".  The narrator is searching for "the halves with him in them", the other half of something that has disappeared, replaced by a recorded voice saying it's time to break the connection.

None of the other books we read this quarter affected me as powerfully and impressed me so deeply with the rich art of their sentences and paragraphs.  Others were more showy in terms of plot or conception, but for me the most impressive books are the ones full of paragraphs as complex and affecting as the paragraph above.

They're Coming For You

Carrie, I find it hilarious that you finished the book all in one big gulp, as you've contradicted Frank McCourt's blurb* right off the bat. Now you have to fight him when the 3 p.m. bell rings. I hear he's a scrapper.

This really is a remarkable book. (Physically beautiful object too, as all McSweeney's books are.)

Most of what stuck with me about this novel has already been cited: Murphy's and the spoon-bending narrator's perfectly harsh yet lyrical voices; the blend of surrealist details and symbols with a very real world and real family; the rambly but focused quality of the prose; the almost grotesque quality of details at times and the simple beauty of them at others; and, yes, the dog. (Though the police horse is memorable for me as well, Kassia.) Often I'm annoyed when an author holds back the narrator's name; it feels too much like a device, but here the character is conjured so perfectly, right from the start, that it never bothered me. Murphy is able to pull off a lot of magic tricks here, and it's hard to figure her sleight of hand, exactly.

In workshops and writing classes, you can't go 20 minutes without someone talking about using different/better/exactly-the-right details. And yet, it's incredibly rare to come across a book where so many of the details line by line actually are memorable and resonant. Not just window-dressing that builds a world but integral to the narrative itself. Where the sensory quality seems true and easily conjured at once.

And the deadpan way in which these are often rendered gave the novel a great sense of humor to me. What could be just tragedy -- the heaps of garbage, the frozen-over toilet in winter, a girl allowing herself to be groped for free hot dogs -- is often less depressing because we are not forced to wallow in the awfulness of it. The narrator refuses that simple a reaction. She is not reflecting the story, so much as channeling it. This is her life and when you're a kid, you don't have a large enough frame of reference to judge that life against others. It's just her life, at this point, she's too young for it to be otherwise. And in that I definitely see a connection to those memorable girl narrators you mentioned in your initial post, Carrie. What makes this such a page-turner (because it is, despite not being plotted in a conventional page-turnery way) is the narrator's breathless recounting of all this as she experiences it, clean of judgment.

The I Capture the Castle connection is thus deemed valid!

*“This is a hell of a book. You might not be able to finish Here They Come in one sitting, but it will haunt you till you do. What detail! What characters! I can imagine both Jane Austen and Raymond Carver pouring over this masterly novel.”  — Frank McCourt, author of Angela’s Ashes

Sentimentality and Craft: Fun Topics!

Damn, you so promised we wouldn't get deep!

Can we not both be right? We are talking about a little girl, and for all her coolness, she's a child, who is revealing her life as it is. Sure, it's filtered through her point-of-view (I must say that I didn't notice the POV shifts as such, which means I was deeply immersed in the reading; I tend to notice craft while reading when the author is failing miserably), but it's a pretty bald recitation of facts.

One thing I did notice is that this story does not, like many novels of this ilk, come off as a "how I became who I am" story. We are not looking back; we seem largely in the present throughout. This isn't a case of a someone lamenting over the scent of cookies, and I think that makes this a particularly fresh look at, well, life.

But as to the question of sentimentality versus sentimentality, our narrator loves her family, deeply. Even her father, maybe even his slut. In her recounting of events, she's oddly protective of her mother. You can be, I think, factual (such a fluid word, makes one love English) and sentimental. I think it's one of the things that makes domestic drama so powerful. You will say anything and everything behind closed doors, but there's a public face that must be maintained.

I find that some of the smaller characters remain with me. Bonnie's boyfriend. Could have been so much more perverted than he was. The Slut, who sometimes seemed to be flailing in a pool she didn't mean to enter. Ma Mere, who, ultimately, was just an old lady and couldn't explain that to the kids who were scornful of her.

Circling back to craft, the story's style is skillfully maintained. Matt discussed the fragmentary structure of the style, and that's a large part of it. Murphy's voice is spot on as well. The first person narrator, who carefully speaks of "we" and talks about "our" various things. It is the voice of a child because it is, to me, the voice of a child parroting the words of her parents. We do this, we do that. We mustn't bother our brother. We should ask our mother. Did you notice the style right away or did it just flow into you naturally?